Check out the transcript from Season 2, Episode 5 of AHRI’s podcast, Let’s Take This Offline, where Tiffany Blight CPHR, First Assistant Secretary – People and Culture at the Department of Home Affairs, shares how practitioners can arm themselves with the right skills to thrive in HR leadership roles.
Listen to the episode below and read more about AHRI’s podcast here.
Beth Hall: This podcast is recorded on Wurundjeri land. I’d like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of this land, and the land on which you are listening today. Welcome to the final episode of Season Two of Let’s Take This Offline, a podcast from the Australian HR Institute that brings you closer to the minds helping to shape the future of HR. My name is Beth Hall. I’m a certified fellow of AHRI and I’ve been in people and culture for over 15 years, working with dynamic organisations globally that focus on strategies to enhance workplace wellness and performance. I’m passionate about advancing HR to create positive work environments, and my masters in Organisational Psychology has been instrumental in shaping my approach to HR. As HR continues to evolve, the skills and capabilities required for HR leadership roles are also shifting. So how can emerging HR leaders arm themselves with the necessary capabilities and expertise to be ready to navigate an increasingly complex business landscape? To find out, we’re chatting with Tiffany Blight, an experienced HR leader with extensive public service leadership experience, currently as the First Assistant Secretary – People Division with the Federal Government. In this episode, Tiffany shares insights on the essential skills needed for strategies to develop these capabilities and how HR practitioners can position themselves for future leadership opportunities. Tiffany is a seasoned HR practitioner with extensive experience in leadership development, change management and strategic HR planning. She is an AHRI certified practitioner and a member of the Australian Institute of Company Directors. Tiff, thanks so much for joining me to talk about HR leadership today. It’s really great to have you.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Thanks for having me.
Beth Hall: So Tiff, talk to me – you’ve had such an extensive career in public service. Can you tell me what’s kept you there, what’s kept you engaged, what’s led you towards the career path of HR leadership with the public service?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Absolutely. I actually studied to be a primary school teacher, so I had a really strong desire to teach. I didn’t end up pursuing that career. At the end of my degree, I ended up seeing the public service test, and that led me to a role in the Commonwealth public service. I joined in 1998 as a graduate. So I’ve actually been in the public service now for 26 years, and I stayed basically because I had such a strong alignment to purpose. It was really important to me through my career that what I was doing in supporting the government and supporting the Australian people, that was more of a drive. So at different points, I retested with myself, do I want to step out and do I want to do something in the private sector? And no, I just kept gravitating back. Purpose was really important to me, and then I’ve ended up mostly staying in HR roles with organisations that are part of that kind of national security context, because, again, it’s that really strong alignment to the purpose of those particular agencies. I’ve stepped out here and there, but I’ve pretty much stayed in HR for 80% of my roles, because I really have that strong desire to help people. And there’s absolutely nothing more gratifying to me than when you know you’ve helped just one person and made a difference for them, and then over time, there’s just been that natural kind of evolution where I’ve moved through and up into leadership positions because I’ve wanted to see if I could expand that impact on larger numbers of people, and then been in situations where I’ve made connections to things and then ended up leading that.
Beth Hall: Yeah, that’s great. So purpose and impact. So what great reasons to stay there so long. So when you have zigzagged out of HR and back into HR, did you find that you picked up some transferable skills or context that helped you as a HR practitioner? Did the actual outcome of those moves help you as a HR leader?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Oh, absolutely. Principally, you see the application of some of the work that you do in HR in the business, and I think you bring that back into the role, so that you’re not only thinking about doing the work that you need to do as an HR professional, but you’re really considering how that will feel for the person who’s receiving it on the other end, yes, and what always was really present to me, because HR is part of a broader corporate offering, is that we are part of a broader offering, and therefore people are not only being asked to respond to HR activities as managers, they also need to do their finance piece. They. Also need to do their other governance pieces, and so we’ve really got to be mindful that we aren’t just one thing that they have to do. And I think that’s really had an impact on me, client focus. I always bring client focus back, because that’s kind of the biggest learning. I stepped out each time.
Beth Hall: Yeah, yeah. I couldn’t agree more. I went to operations for a couple of years, and it hit me that timing was the problem. It wasn’t the solution, it wasn’t the initiative, it wasn’t the context or quality. It was actually just mistimed. And to your point, if it’s colliding with competing priorities, something has to give. So yeah, that’s great context of that customer mindset. Like, how are we always thinking about that internal customer? So 26 years, wow, I imagine HR has evolved significantly within Australia over the past 26 years. So when you think about the core capabilities that now sit within that HR practitioners remit, that really is the difference between a HR practitioner and a HR leader. Where do you see those capabilities even today, or where you feel that they’re heading?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: So the biggest one for me, and I think it’s probably pertinent to any leadership role, but more so in an HR context, and to your point about how things have shifted over time is curiosity. We have to just keep asking the question, why we do the things we do, how we do them, what the context is that we work within, what’s changing, because all of that context is so relevant for then what you then decide to do as an HR leader in meeting and managing that new context. And so curiosity is really big, asking those questions, connecting the bigger picture. That’s something that I see often missed as people coming through, and it’s often a question that I’m putting back to people saying, how does what you’re doing and what you’re telling me connect in to where we’re working for the agency we’re working from, for the public service or for the profession like, where are you connecting the dots? Because we don’t live in isolation from each other, and we need to bring all parts to a particular problem, patience, resilience, big, certainly as an HR leader, being a great communicator and being confident and backing yourself, that’s really important, because that then lends itself to great stakeholder relationships and the influence piece with your senior executive, they need to know and trust the information that you’re giving them, and one way that they will derive that is how confident you are in communicating with them. So it’s really important. The other thing, I would say, is being a great problem solver. So importantly, when you move up into senior HR positions, what you’re dealing with is when things aren’t going particularly well. So the problems become more complex. There’s higher risk associated with those problems, and you’re the one that’s having to break through those barriers. So when things are going great. You absolutely want your teams to be taking that and running with it. What you’re dealing with as an HR leader at a senior executive position are when things aren’t going so well, and that being a really good communicator, because you’re the person that people are turning to to trust and make sure that you are answering the questions. You’re providing the right advice. So if you have the confidence, you back yourself, and you’re delivering it with that confidence, then they’ll trust the information that you’re relating to them. Also really think collaboratively, like I live to collaborate. I love to engage and talk to other people and find out how things connect in – you have to make that just a regular part of what you’re doing. I never profess to be the smartest person in the room. I always know that by engaging others and finding and looking at things from different perspectives, I will gain from that, and I will give more rich advice and the last one, and I often talk about this, it’s one of those things that really drives me when I come back and I talk about client services, what I’m looking for is the yes, if not the No, because one of the risks for HR is that we default to what the policy says, or what leg says, or the reasons why you shouldn’t do something. What we need to be in the space of is finding a way to give the answer and navigate those things on behalf of the client to get as close as we can to the outcome they need. They don’t always know how to get the outcome that they need. That’s our role. But if you start from a yes, if you open up opportunities,
Beth Hall: I love that, and it’s so true Tiff. I think that journey to HR leadership is really about the ability to look at problems from every angle. So to your point, you are doing your environmental scanning to understand the context in which you’re operating, but that curiosity around, okay, that might not be how we’ve done it before. That might not be the policy, but I agree, and I’m aligned with the intent and what we’re trying to achieve. So therefore I’m going to think differently, and I’m going to influence my stakeholders and solve that complex problem. Beautiful. I love that. That’s going to be my new line.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: I got it printed onto a canvas and it sits behind me. Actually, I got it as a gift on a canvas I should add, and it sits behind me when I do all my divisional meetings, so right behind me.
Beth Hall: Yeah, that’s great. And again, that’s just that difference between HR following the book and the policy and I’m HR with the right intent to do the right thing by people and the business and just that reframe is critical for that leadership role. I love that. Thank you for sharing. So you’ve mentioned collaboration, you’ve mentioned communication, you’ve mentioned the fact that you need to get people to buy into your expertise when you’re influencing without authority, when you’re essentially trying to support other functions cross functionally, to be able to change the way they do things or implement a new way of working for employees across the business, any tips on how to influence and how to get key stakeholders on board with whatever your HR strategy is.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: So you need to first make sure that those key stakeholders know who you are and what you can bring. I’m a big advocate for networking, and networking at every level and every opportunity. I’m also big on you should have an answer before you walk in the room to a group of people. If you know that you’ve got a meeting on a particular issue, you should know what you’re walking into. Don’t wait to be in that meeting and then find out how people are viewing whatever it is that you’re putting on the table. So the more you can do to go and find that out, one on one, if possible, far easier. Your ability to negotiate or to influence one on one is far better. And then when you walk into that room, you know who your supporters are, and you know the issues that you’ve got that are going to be thrown onto the table, and therefore you’re pre prepared, so absolutely do that groundwork first, and also really being at one with the expertise that you can bring, because that comes down to confidence as well. So when you’re in those engagements and you’re having those conversations, you’re the expert in HR, you need to own that and know that you can actually add value to those conversations. I look for opportunities to help people on a one on one basis. The way I’d like to think about it is, I’m kind of putting a few brownie points in the jar, helping to navigate being proactive. If I have something to offer. I’m already doing it with those key stakeholders. I’m building those brownie points with them, so they’re going to take a little bit of a risk with me if I’m putting something that might be slightly contentious, or if I feel like it’s not going to get full support in the room, because they know the value that I’ve been adding, so therefore they’re willing to take a bit of a risk. So that’s what I do. And then also coming back to that idea of the yes, if, if they see you as a type of person that is a problem solver, then they’re not thinking that you’re putting on the table a problem. They’re already assuming that you’ve thought this through, and that when you’re putting it on the table, you’re thinking about how to do the very best for your particular agency. Again, it’s that building trust you can be doing that immediately. Stop letting people see HR as a barrier, get out there and proactively contribute value.
Beth Hall: Great. So when I hear you say, brownie points, am I right in saying that those are your trust accounts. Ultimately, you’re putting deposits in that trust account, and then that way, if you need to take a withdrawal for whatever reason, it’s not impacting the relationship, because they know if you could, you would because of that. Yes, if mentality absolutely,
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Absolutely. Good, effective stakeholder relationship management and development is exactly that.
Beth Hall: Yeah, wonderful. So when HR, if we look back into HR and where the function came from, it was often viewed as a support function. It was often viewed as a cost center. Sometimes it would sit under the CFO or the COO we’ve seen such a huge shift in not just the navigation of the pandemic and the huge role that HR played, but also the changes in industrial relations and changes in the you know, I think about the risk register in HR, a good two or three of those organizational top 10 risks are people related risks, and it’s really propelled our function and us as practitioners to be able to be at that table and be having a conversation with the executive team. But it’s not happening in all businesses, so in some cases, it still is, the executive team are making a decision, and then they’re delivering that decision to HR, and they’re saying, Go and make that happen when potentially the people, challenges or the complexities around HR haven’t necessarily been considered in that decision making process. Do you have any advice for our listeners on how they can elevate HR and not be seen as a support or cost function and be seen as a strategic partner.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: So what I would say is that at that point, what you’ve just described, it’s too late. They haven’t turned their mind to even knowing that HR in that context exists. You have. To be out there having those conversations and demonstrating the value you can bring, so that at the point those decisions are being made, the question arises, has someone brought HR into this? Because they already know the value that you can bring, you can’t convince them after the fact, because then you’re just playing human nature, and humans will just double down on a decision that they’ve made. What you need to do is have shown them prior to that what you can do. How can you find the opportunities? Go and meet with those key stakeholders, or the senior executives, bring the data and evidence to bear. Hey, I’ve been tracking a particular trend in your area of the business. Think you really need to know about this, and here’s some ideas about how you might be able to mitigate it. If you’re showing them that value, they’ll bring you to the table,
Beth Hall: So you are the value added partner that is working across the business, putting those brownie points to your point around trust in those bank accounts, so that when a decision is being made, they’re saying, We can’t make this decision without Tiff. Has anybody spoken to Tiff? Correct? Because you’re front of mind because of your proactive work.
So Tiff, you mentioned earlier that you’re very client focused, and it’s really clear that you are working to the yes and yes if and supporting various different clients across your agency when you have competing priorities, whereby you have different clients needing HR support or resources at The same time, and you don’t have the ability to meet all of those needs you mentioned earlier that you connect everything back to the bigger picture. Can you share just some of your decision making filters around what you prioritise in that example of competing priorities? And how do you deliver that news to the client if indeed that ‘Yes’ is a ‘Yes, but not right now’?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: It’s such a pertinent question. This is something that we’re facing at the moment. So with my particular agency, there are a lot of competing priorities that have come down, and that is applying a lot of pressure on HR, both a good and a scary thing at the same time. It’s great because we’re definitely in the senior executive mind. Scary, because obviously we’re also having to respond to those competing priorities. So we went through an exercise where I landed and very physically in a couple of pages what the key priorities were, as synthesised as I possibly could, and agreed that with my next level up. The reason I did that is it provides an objective basis to go back and test against. So you’re not trying to, in the moment, say, but I’m doing X and you’ve just asked me to do Y. That becomes really difficult. It becomes an emotional conversation, and one about, well, why can’t you do everything if you’ve actually written them down and very carefully said, This is how I’ve ascribed to my resources in a way that delivers against these priorities. So I can put these, and I can hear what you’re saying to me. Absolutely. Think we need it. Let’s come back and talk about the list of priorities, and what I can deprioritise to pick up on what you need me to do. It makes the conversation logical, practical and objective, and so that’s exactly the point that we’re in at the moment. The other really important point is you are not an island, and so you’ve got to make sure that you’re investing in your leadership team beneath you, so that you’re not the only person being relied upon. We’ve spent a lot of time in my particular agency building a very strong leadership team, and I’m so energized and delighted about how well the group of people work together and have each other’s backs. And so that allows us to extend ourselves, because someone is always willing to step in and help. They’re not just working in their particular area of business. So that then means that we can deliver a broader range of priorities than we could before, and so they, in turn, are doing the same, investing in their own, and one of my particular branch heads is doing some cross-skilling, so they are pre positioned then to move resources where the priorities rest. And people are ready, they’re trained up, and they’re able to lean into those and they feel confident. They’re well supported to do so. So they’re probably the two things I’d say.
Beth Hall: Yeah, that’s great. So leading from the front in terms of being really clear with the business as to what success looks like and how you’re supporting them, but then also, what I heard from you there is really shifting your leadership team from more of a I based resource to a T shaped model, whereby they’re multidisciplinary and therefore can be able to lean into different areas when it becomes particularly busy. Because the reality is that everything in people is holistic. Everything affects everyone. It’s not or that’s not my job that sits with another specialist, because we’re dealing with people, so it all interrelates anyway. So thank you for sharing that. So with those. Priorities that you mentioned, that you have carved out and leveled up in terms of sharing with the leadership team. What are those metrics of success for you? What are those metrics that matter, that tell you as a HR leader, that, yes, we’re on track, we’re delivering to the business and we’re having the desired impact?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Another terrific question, another one that we are literally grappling with right now in our agency. I’ll be honest with you, I’ve never seen data in HR done well, it is really, really difficult, so one of the first things that we are doing is a stock take on all of the data that we’re collecting so we can surface it and understand if it’s useful, or potentially if it could be, how we might be able to connect those dots together to provide the useful insights. And from an HR context, I’m looking at how we’re delivering our services at meeting the service standards that we’ve decided for ourselves, and in some cases, we haven’t got those sets. So there’s a piece of work there. The second bit is, are clients satisfied with what they’re receiving from us? Now I don’t pull any punches there, because we’re in HR, people aren’t necessarily going to be delighted with an outcome if they’re going through a performance process, but what I do want them to feel is that they’ve been treated with respect and courtesy, that the process has run along the lines of what they were expecting from timeliness, that the support has been in place. So I want to get a feel for that, and I also want to know how it’s impacting from an organizational perspective. And that one is critical for me. Where we’re shifting is starting to think about as we design things, what does success look like? So therefore, what do we need to measure to understand if we’ve shifted from A to B? I don’t think it’s a case of new measures. It’s about taking what we’ve got at the moment and then integrating and interpreting that together to build a better picture of what’s happening. So probably, to answer your question, I wouldn’t say we’re there yet, but for example, some of the things that I’m thinking about in terms of transforming our culture, what’s that going to look like? What’s it going to appear to be, if we’re actually getting some kind of traction? Is I want to know whether or not people are feeling more engaged. I’m going to be looking at survey results. I’m going to be looking to see if there’s a shift in sentiment. But I’ve got to be understanding the context, because we know that when people answer surveys. It’s very much about what’s happening to them right then and there. I want to understand if they’re joining, staying, going. I want to know, again, the context, what the exit survey is telling me. What’s the market demand? How many applications are we getting? How are we presenting the market? What does the media look like? I want to understand the themes that are shifting in behaviors at what level have we got problems? Is that changing? Is it more junior, or is it in particular cohorts of people or in particular areas of the business? And I also want to know if people are engaging with L&D, that will show me that they’ve heard a message around skilling up in particular areas, that we need capability, because they’re reaching out to invest in themselves. So that’s kind of where we’re leading to we’re not where we need to be at the moment, but we’re on that evolution, and it’s a big, big piece of work for us.
Beth Hall: Yeah, yeah. So look, we, as you’ve said, like we’re we’re not as sophisticated as we could or should be within HR when it comes to analytics, often, because it’s we spend most of our time trying to find the numbers, and therefore don’t leave ourselves enough time to actually look at clean data and derive insights from it. I’m hoping, with the new technology coming through and HRIS sophistication getting much better, it will allow us to turn our attention more to the impact measures and more to the Insight work, as opposed to, as I say, cleaning the data to get it ready to present. It is a very interesting space. I think, moving forward, I love the point that you made around people might not necessarily appreciate the decision being made or the interaction that they’ve had with HR, but we still can be humanistic. We still can do that with respect and care. And I think sometimes when we are under resourced, and there’s so many different competing priorities, sometimes we can lose sight of that we’re in the people business, how any advice on people coming through that potentially don’t necessarily have the power or influence to deal with their workload and are literally moving from conversation to conversation. Any advice on how they can keep that front of mind to make sure that we are putting that humanistic lens on everything that we do.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: It’s a good question, because we often see people who’ve worked for long periods of time in difficult parts of HR, so in your well being performance management spaces, what they see, unfortunately, is a lot of negatives, because that’s what they’re dealing with. It’s not a positive, happy place. People aren’t there because everything’s going well, and I think there’s a real risk of that kind of compassion overload. Mood or fatigue. I think really importantly, people need to be attuned to how they’re feeling around that. Think if you get to a point where your reaction or response to things is cynical, or you’re assuming a negative or you’re looking to go through a process quickly, you’re probably at the point where you’re experiencing some of that fatigue, and so taking yourself out of that space and trying something else, and so you’re investing in something that’s perhaps a little bit more optimistic and positive to lift, lift you up again and fill your cup. I know a lot of people love that space, and it’s wonderful. It’s wonderful when people are really highly skilled and they’re really embracing that type of work, but I think we all need to just be really clear when you need a break from that and cycling to do other things. The benefit of being in HR is that you can experience so many different areas. I do remember coming up through how hard it is when you’re not able to identify or have that responsibility for setting the agenda for yourself. It is really, really tough. That’s where it comes down to having a great relationship with your supervisor and being in a position where you can really freely talk about what you can and can’t do, and making sure that they’re aware of what energises you. It’s a two way street. So what you get out is what you put in. If you’re not in a relationship with your manager that looks like that. You can vote with your feet. And I think I actually said that at the recent re conference, we all individually hold an immense amount of power, and that is that we can choose the place that we work. And whilst you feel like you can’t, you really can.
Beth Hall: That’s a great call to action Tiff, to check in with yourself if you do have compassion fatigue, if you have gone through vicarious trauma, is it now impacting the way you are treating your clients and the experience that they’re having, and that call to action of going working in different areas and Centres of Excellence is also another great way to round out your skill set to get to leadership as well. You’re certified, aren’t you? Tiff, you’re a certified HR practitioner. The expectation of certified HR practitioners is that they have cycled through multiple areas of centres of excellence, and have essentially got that holistic capability across all of the people experience. Talk to me a little bit around how it’s helped you in terms of your career. Would you recommend that for people that are looking to become future HR leaders?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Definitely critical with any profession is remaining up to date and contemporary with what’s happening in your profession. If you’re not engaging, reading or being aware of changes that impact and affect you, then I think there’s a problem. You really have to lean in on that. And certainly being certified, I went through a senior leader’s pathway, but you’re testing your own understanding of HR. You’re also making sure that you’re keeping really, really abreast of any of those evolutions. And so I go in and listen to the podcasts I attend the events. That’s what helps keep me connected, and that’s really, really important. Again, that comes back to that confidence and trust. When you know your stuff and you’ve got the most contemporary information, you’re aware of the changes in legislation, you know what’s happening the Fair Work Act, you can supplement that through some of the work that Ari does. They’ve got that information available to you. That’s where the trust comes in. What you provide by way of your advice.
Beth Hall: Yeah, and the credibility that comes with that to know that your HR practitioners current is really great. So I’ll put you on the spot here. Then, given your currency, where do you see our practice heading? What do you see if we were to fast forward 5, 10 years, what is the role of the HR leader?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Biggest thing for me is understanding the impact of AI. And I was just having a conversation with someone this morning about that. I really, really want to understand that deeply, and I want to understand the risks and benefits. I always say that there’s going to be a need for us with our critical thinking and creativity skills to supplement that. I don’t think AI is ever going to replace that, but I need to know how I bring my expertise to bear and leverage what AI is going to do with us. So I think for HR practitioners, we need to be across that and deep into it. It’s considered, I think, for most, an IT issue. It is not an IT issue. It is a people issue. So the more we understand about how we can use AI to best effect the better, and then how we can support that as it’s being integrated into our agencies or into any organisation, public or private, that’s really important. So one of the other areas is to be a change leader. So there was a Gartner report that I’d heard about, and they did a survey in 2016 where they looked at the number of average plan changes that people were having to respond to. And at that point it was two. And then in 2022 that has evolved to, on average, 10. Yeah. So for me, I’m thinking, what does that look like in the future? Really important that we’re helping to support people through that change. So we are undergoing massive change, and a lot of that’s driven by some of the technical advancements and also changes in government policy and the more frequent changes that we’re experiencing in every part of our lives. So what is that going to look like in future? People are feeling change fatigue now, so I think there’s a massive role here for us to make sure that we are helping support managers through that, because the impact on people is going to be ever present, and perhaps more so in time. I think we also need to be really, really good coaches, so we’re seeing people come through into senior positions that don’t have the breadth of experience or depth of experience that perhaps they would have a decade or more before because they had time to develop that. Not so the case now, so us being coaches for managers and helping them understand how best to manage their people is really important. They need to inspire, they need to engage. You’re nothing if you don’t have your people there with you, delivering the work. And I think the other big one is balancing that employer employee relationship, things tend to kind of balance and rebalance. So we were employer led, you know, you got what you were given when you joined an organization 20 years ago, and you know, should be happy you’ve got a job, that shift is very much about employees, and we’re all working hard to to attract people, to offer those incentives to join again, whether it private or public sector, offering flex work being that support, we have to really find that right balance and making sure that we are supporting not only our agency but also those individuals getting it right, because it has to work for both parties. So I think there’s a real point for us in navigating through that and supporting our agencies and managers.
Beth Hall: Yeah, that’s great. So I got four then so AI and what’s the role of HR in terms of from a work design perspective, but also from a how do we think differently about resources and work with our technology departments change and the constant change and therefore potentially adaptability being that capability that’s required of everybody in the workforce. Coaches and how do we constantly support and coach those people coming through that are leading teams, and then the last one, the employer, employee. And what is that balance, and how has it shifted? And it’s, it’s an interesting pendulum that keeps on swinging, doesn’t it? So to your point, it was the power of the employer, and then there’s the power of the employee. But then with all of the new legislation coming in, there’s this power dynamic and struggle that’s happening between those two areas. And HR literally are caught in the middle of how do we get the best interests of everyone? So I agree that’s certainly going to be growing over the next five to 10 years. So that’s a great list. Thank you so much. Tiff at the end of every episode, we love to give our podcast guests a scenario that is playing out across Australia that we would love you to respond to. Are you ready for your scenario? Tiff hit me, perfect. Imagine you are mentoring an up and coming HR practitioner. They’re a really strong performer, and they’ve been a key contributor to multiple HR projects over the years. Despite their achievements and a clear vocalised interest in advancing to a HR leadership role, they haven’t moved past that senior HR business partner. They’ve kind of been pigeonholed in that role for some time and a less experienced team member has managed to get to a HR leadership role, and they’ve not been in his HR as long or as senior as this senior HR business partner. So this individual is feeling a little bit frustrated, a little bit devalued, feeling like that. They’re overlooked, and they’ve come to you as their HR leader for some advice on how do they best position themselves in an environment where there’s all of this AI, digital transformation happening, as you mentioned, there is a constant expectation of agile and responsiveness to change that you’ve talked about. How can they think about the way they effectively communicate their value to senior management in order to be able to operate in that context and environment, in order to be the next person that’s chosen to be elevated to a HR leadership role?
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: I think the first thing that I would probably explore with them is what’s missing. One of the best things that you can do is understand those around you who are, in fact, getting those sorts of promotions, and think about what it is that they’re doing that might be different to what you’re doing, and if you can identify that, how you can emulate it. So for me, a lot of it comes down to being visible, making sure that people know that you’re there, that you can be trusted for the advice. That you give, that you’re leaning in and looking for those opportunities, and you’re not waiting for it to come to you. I have seen because I have a lot of people that I mentor, and I do see people kind of having this expectation that something will come to them inevitably. That’s not what happens. You create your own luck, and so people who are competing with you for those roles, they’re not waiting. They’re leaning in. They’re proactively making those contacts, and they’re making sure that people know the value that they can give you shouldn’t wait. You don’t wait for when you think that’s going to count. You do it anytime that you see there’s something that you can bring to bear. That’s how you actually make it not look like you’re being arrogant or self promotional in any way, because it’s always a risk when you’re out there telling people how great you are, but if you’re always looking at adding value and saying, I’ve seen me so, you know, I’ve noticed this, how can I help you fill in the gaps? It’s not just about you. You need to do it authentically. You want to help, that’s why you’re in HR. People see you then as somebody to go to. I think the other part I used to always say, and this is what I did moving through more junior levels, is I would look at my manager, and I would look at what they did, and that is what I would do. But what I wanted to do is make sure I was thinking the way that they were thinking, I was applying the lens that they were thinking at. Because when I got the opportunities to act, I was just naturally already thinking in that headspace. And so very quickly moved from acting into permanently being appointed at that level. And I’ve pretty much done that the whole way through, and I think you’ve pointed to that, you know, agile and the digital piece and change management and all of that you’ve got to know and understand those things that are happening around you. So it’s being aware of your context that you’re working and aware of what those departmental priorities are, and knowing and understanding that. So when the opportunity arises for you to bring that to bear, you’re always adding something. Never stay quiet in the meeting. Listen, take it in, hear and understand what people are saying. Make it a point in every meeting to say something, to add something to that conversation, and that’s how people see you. So that’s kind of what I would say. The other thing I think you also really need to be alert to is just the way that internal politics works, and networking, getting out there and having those conversations, you will understand that. So you really need to be a careful listener in that regard as well.
Beth Hall: Yeah, and that look that comes back to those capabilities you spoke about at the very start of this conversation, if we iterate, curiosity, communication, building relationships, adding values, solving problems proactively. So it really is to your point, building those capabilities of a HR leader in order to therefore become that HR leader. Some great, great takeaways there. Before we wrap up. Tiff you have been talking about currency and how to stay current and how to make sure that your credibility as a HR practitioner? Are there any key resources such as books or podcasts that you would recommend HR practitioners looking to elevate to that HR leadership position?≠
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: So obviously, the Let’s Take This Offline podcast, number one. Someone recently talked to me about The Mentor podcast, so I’ve just subscribed to that with Mark Bouris, and Diary of a CEO. I want to test those two as well. I’m actually quite big on listening to audiobooks. I live out of town, so I’ve got a 45 minute drive each way, and so I really listen to a lot of audiobooks. And so the one I’m listening to at the moment is by Robert Greene. It’s called Mastery, and that’s about being the very best that you can in your area of expertise. Also picked up a copy of Matt Church’s Amplifiers. So that’s something quite pertinent to our transformation journey. So I’ve just started on that one as well. Other books that I’ve listened to that I found incredibly helpful, any books on neuroscience. I’ve read Nudge, Yes and Influence. The last two are from Robert Cialdini. Really good, because that gives you insight into human behaviour, and so you can think then about how you’re crafting your messages to help people get to and I’m going to say the right answer, but when I say that, it’s the ethical right answer, not manipulative, if that makes sense, not about what I want to get out of it, but actually about what I think is very best for you. So I think those books are really, really good. I also read Atomic Habits, big on that one, by James Clear. A good one is Surrounded By Idiots, which is about personality types. Again. You know, it’s really in that psychology space. HR and psychology are hand in hand. And the last one I would suggest is by Malcolm Gladwell called The Tipping Point. So at what point do you get to having so many people talking about something or invest in a particular message or strategy that everybody wants to do? And so you need to be aware of that, because if. Are looking at transformational change. That’s the kind of thing that you’re driving towards. At what point do you know that enough people are on board that this thing is going to happen? Because then you’re really setting yourself up for success?
Beth Hall: Yeah, wonderful. What a great list. And certainly in your responses today, behavioral science is weaved throughout. You know, when we’ve talked about capability, they’re human capabilities. They’re the human advantage that you’ve lent into as opposed to the more technical side of things that may have in our early career, supported our elevation. It’s now what is that human side of behavior and change and influence that you’ve certainly called out there. So thank you so much. Tiff. It’s been absolutely wonderful to speak to you and really appreciate your generosity in sharing with future HR practitioners how you’ve been so successful over the last 26 years as a certified HR practitioner. So I really appreciate your time. Thank you.
Tiffany Blight FCPHR: Thank you.
Beth Hall: Thanks for listening to this episode of Let’s Take This Offline podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, don’t forget to follow us wherever you listen to podcasts and share with your network. To learn more about the Australian HR Institute, visit our website, ahri.com.au. We’ll link all the great recommendations from Tiff in the show notes so you can get listening and reading.
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